_ The Zero Emissions Strategy Conference

The Discussion Forum

Date: Sunday 31 Aug 1997
To: Robert Ayres (ayres@the-commons.org)
From: E. Britton EcoPlan (britton@the-commons.org)
Subject: Case studies

Back in the mid-eighties we delivered a Europe-wide (18 country) market penetration strategy for Bandag (by the way, of course our product was a service), who already were selling defined service packages for truckers and bus companies. (Michelin and the others came later.) It worked for hem (and their customers) when (a) fleet size was large, or (b) the client was near his local Bandage dealer (there are a lot of them around), and because (c) they were CV tires (big, professional drivers, expensive, lend themselves to quality retreading and because of the huge difference between the price of a retread and a new tire every time around. Terrific business. Why don't you go to Bandag and ask them to come clean. If they don't want to, all you have to do is go over to a couple of big truckers or bus companies and ask them how exactly it works these days. Our experience is that they are glad to help (since it doesn't cost them anything or give away their store).

And of course you know that Ericsson (among others) now advertises themselves as a 'service solutions company' and are there fore ready to deliver not physical products but services on a contractual basis. (Go visit them at http://www.src.ericsson.se. and check them out.)

And of course all those US electrical companies, from Southern California Edison on. And and....

Does this help at all? Or is it just much trodden ground? And if it is so well known, then what's the problem?

Synoptic Table Sent by Robert Ayres on 31 August

Eric, In addition to the following I would like to mention re format of conference; Its still not easy to find new stuff. We think that EVERYTHING new (edited to delete anything personal) should go into "What's new, in reverse chrono order and stay there for the current week, including papers and remarks on papers. The specific podium piece could be excluded, but mentioned. People don't search except the first time through; they scan for new - and not finding it in "what's new", sign off.

To: postmaster@the-commons.org,
From: Robert Ayres, Forum Moderator
Date: August 23, 1997
Re: Comments on some of the comments

I'm happy to see that the "system" is now working pretty well, and that we have a reasonable number of registrants. Obviously our timing was very bad -- almost everybody who might be interested at another time of year is somewhere else right now. I trust they all get sunburned while we work.

More seriously, I'm still waiting for suggestions about possible case studies. In this context, let me say to Brendan Barrett that the UNEP/UNIDO data base on clean production is valuable, although it is not nearly as valuable as it could be. It seems a pity to spend so much money on specific projects and so little on documentation and analysis -- especially in terms of exploring the issue of generalizability. It is very difficult to see how the accumulated UNEP/UNIDO experience in this area applies to other situations, other countries, etc. Those are fundamental problems with the whole case study approach, in general, of course.

Another remark for Barrett, however. The UNEP/UNIDO data base deals with "clean technology" or "cleaner production". It applies to the second stage of my three stage scheme (See Introduction). Sadly, it does not concern itself with the third stage, which is the important one. I agree that stage II is more "practical" at this point in time, but it very soon runs into limits. Since the product is unchanged, it is only the means of production that is improved. But, if all the production processes in the world were as clean as possible, we would still be in very serious trouble. Think about it.

Tue, 12 Aug 1997 13:30:59 +0200
From: Robert.AYRES@insead.fr
Subject: case studies
To: britton@the-commons.org

Dear Eric:

Re. case studies, I have done none myself, up to now, that deserve the name. What I have done is already in the library. Even if I knew of such a study from another source, of course, I could not use it for the conference. There is both a copyright problem and the fact that it would have to be in digital form. I've said this before. The potential copyright problems should be emphasized to all potential contributors - e.g. Philippe

There is one possibility that might be a partial answer. My graduate student, Geraldo Ferrer, currently at the University of North Carolina, did four case studies for his PhD thesis. I hope that he will be willing to contribute one or two of them to the conference. This might give him problems with regard to subsequent publication, however, so I can't guarantee anything.I sent him a message (copied to you). Anyhow, if this doesn't work, there is nothing more I can do about it.

Remember, though, that I am seeking IDEAS for case studies, not the studies themselves.

Bob

Comment by Philippe LeRouic Crist, OECD
Monday, 11 Aug 1997

Professor Robert Ayres, Zero Emissions Strategies Conference Moderator
robert.ayres@the-commons.org

Dear Mr. Ayres,

I have been following with some interest the evolution of the web-based zero-emissions conference. However, after reading through the description of the project, I have some questions regarding the ultimate objective of this interesting endeavor.

1. What specifically are the differences, if any, between the approach which you appear to be setting out in this conference and for the UNU's future efforts under this heading, and that of the original ZERI program as set out by Gunter Pauli in his presentation to the meeting. Is yours primarily a pure research effort, and theirs more of an demonstration program? Will they be run as parallel tracks, or will one take on a lead role with the other to follow.

2. It strikes me as an interesting idea in principle to build up a series of "third generation" case studies based on actual or planned projects in industry or in other operational settings? But once you have them, what precisely do you intend to do with them? Will you, for example , use them only as illustrations and examples or will you seek to compare them and draw some wider conclusions. If so, how will you aggregate them?

3. On the same matter -- it might be useful to see some of these case studies on the web site so that visitors might have a better idea of their potential.

Finally, as you know, we have been working over the past 4 years with an international scientific group here at the OECD's Environment Directorate to make some useful progress on the topic of "Environmentally Sustainable Transportation". Would you like us to provide some background materials in the conference library? We might also think of some useful cross-links. I look forward to hearing from you on these several points.

Cordially, Philippe LeRouic Crist, Consultant to the OECD Environment Directorate, Paris

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Philippe LeRouic Crist, (OECD):
From: Robert Ayres
Date: 8/12/97, 12:08 AM

Nice to hear from you! I'm going to avoid answering your first question in full, because the decision will not be mine and the answer depends in part on what we learn from this conference. It seems safe to say, however, that my approach is probably more research oriented than Gunter's.

To answer your second question, yes, I would seek to draw wider conclusions. Our idea is to subject each case to several generalizability tests

• (1) How applicable is it in other locations?
• (2) How does it scale? (Do the economics look as good, or better, on a large scale?
• (3) Does it (i.e. the generic version) offer sufficient economic benefits in the short term to justify the expectation that it would penetrate the relevant markets without government assistance? Or would subsidies be required?

As to your third point, my papers (see library) do describe some of the possible cases, but the point of this conference is that we don't have nearly enough. We are seeking candidates. If you (or anybody else out there) have ideas, please feel free to put them into play!

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Sender: DPrice000@aol.com
Fri, 8 Aug 1997 14:03:
To: postmaster@the-commons.org
Subject: Conference subjects - Paper topics

The subject matter of this conference seems to be open. I am wondering if it is appropriate to submit a paper concerning a hydropower energy conversion scheme. Our technology is novel and does not use dams. Both the high costs of the dams and the environmental pitfalls of dams can be avoided. Today I sent an E-mail to register. Dan Price, Denver, Colorado USA.

To: Dan Price
From: Robert Ayres
Date: 8/8/97

Thanks for your inquiry. Eric has already replied, I see, but to answer your first question specifically -- and you may not be the only one to ask -- no formal registration is required. All you need do is show up at the Website.

Your second question concerns the relevance of your work on innovative dam-free hydropower. I must admit, I would not have thought of something like that as a possible candidate case study, but on second thought that is only because I wouldn't have thought of such a possibility. I was thinking more in terms of wrinkles on existing technologies. But actually, the more I reflect, the more it seems to me that we should take a look at your ideas. So, if you are willing to expose them to comment, please feel free to do so. I would only suggest that you be careful not to prematurely publish anything that might be patentable.

Subject to that constraint, I must admit I am very curious about your scheme. Tell us what you can about your ideas. But don't go on at length about why they haven't attracted attention thus far. All truly innovative ideas run into the same sort of barriers. The trick is to overcome them. It will take good arguments and perserverence.

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